Jon Goldman, CEO, Brand Launcher, How To Become An Exceptional Leader

June 19, 2018

Jon is a business growth expert, master facilitator, and the business guru’s guru. He was co-owner of a promotional company that ranked #26 out of 24,000 nationally. Since he sold out, he has devoted his time to developing Brand Launcher where he and his team of expert business mentors specialize in helping owners grow their businesses while reducing its dependence on them. Jon is famous for his Turning Point Program, an intense on-site experience designed to guide high-level entrepreneurs to their next chapter in life and business. Jon’s powerful presentations combine business savvy with deep personal insight, earning top ratings across hundreds of industries.

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Podcast Highlights

  • Tell yourself that being a good leader means shifting control and increasing competence in your team. In other words… you need to let go. Task by task.
  • Ask yourself: How can I turn this into a training opportunity? What do they need from me?
  • Rather than solving someone’s problems, ask them for solutions. How would they approach the problem? How might they solve it?
  • Offer suggestions, but, as hard as it may be, do NOT provide all of the answers.

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Show Transcript

Umar:  Hello everyone today I have John Goldman the C.E.O. of Turning Point joining me today. John welcome to the program.


Jon:  Thanks I am really excited to be with you today.


Umar:  So John you hand your business here in good old ball toward the center of the universe and you moved it to Israel tell me what prompted the move.


Jon:  So we're not just in Israel were actually international. You know I have traveled I spent time traveling all around the world. And in my travels Ultimately I ended up in Israel, I travel around Europe and I had a one-way ticket around the worlds and while I was in Europe. I guess you have to understand what prompted the whole thing was, when I was in college some people were brought up to maybe be doctors or lawyers and I was brought up somehow to be in marketing in your business by my down by my training and so after I graduated college I was raised to start looking now and during college. I had the world's largest student run advertising and public relations agency and I was recognized by Harvard Business School for creating such an Agency and I had all sorts of offers to work in agencies afterwards but then after that it was like you know what let me go explore the world a bit so when it is…. I start traveling around the world and I was a card carrying hedonist which I'm not anymore I hope and as I was traveling and so I ended up, In all sorts of experimentation things and end up in a Christian monastery and then in a Buddhist monastery now lives in a cave and then I stopped speaking for one week that's the last time I did that and I stop eating for one week and I drink water and then I stop moving for a week and I live blindfold in the forest and then ultimately, I made my way on my journey around the world and up in Israel and felt a connection to the place I find it to be one of the few we call thrive zones in the world we've identified just a few thrive zones where people are absolutely thriving economically, physically, emotionally and it's an amazing place so we set up an office in a home in Israel as well as in America so that's kind of what got me here.


Umar: So Jon I read the book Start up Nation have you come across it?


Jon: Absolutely, you know and that's part of what's going on here is that there's more startup per capita in Israel than anywhere in the world meaning more than United States more than Kenya, more than Germany, Japan or China which is crazy.


Umar: So you know being intimately familiar with folks in Baltimore the U.S. and Israel so what's the distinction What are you finding different there in terms of the vibe and energy and desire to be entrepreneurial?


Jon: You know I think that what's important is that people regardless of where they are they ask the big question what's this about why am I doing what I'm doing and during my travels I found that that question is asked a lot here like what am I doing and why am I here because it's not an easy place to be but sometimes we look at resistance as something that we don't want; but the truth is resistance is what makes us so much stronger and so much better if the fights worth fighting for and so what I found here is that due to the intensity of the challenge of making the desert come alive in blossom when hasn't blossom for a couple thousand years, and when the people the countries around them all want to wipe them out and when the entire country is about the size of us saw the New Jersey but there's more reporters per square foot than anywhere in the world. So that sense of why which is some of the things I want to talk about is being driven by a very clear purpose if you own a business and if you're trying to drive your business that sense of because is something I really want to talk about we're going to get to soon and remind me to come back to because it's a fundamental process.


Umar: So we've worked together in the past I've worked for you for some of your clients and one of the things that you were doing when we knew each other was, companies would come in that had a successful company that may have been you know at a plateau and you got them to see an insight or develop a strategy that allowed them to radically grow their business can you tell me about one of those experiences a company that came in how you got the insight and what the results were?


Jon:  Absolutely, let's start off with how I blend the business and the personal. So we spoke about the personal on the business side show you know I still own me a partner in Goldman promotions we were the twenty fifth largest promotion company in North America out of about or I guess maybe twenty five thousand were probably at the twenty seventh largest in over thirty five million a year had it offices and one hundred to two hundred seventy employees and I sold out during that process I learned a lot about what works and what doesn't work and in my next iteration was the company you're talking about which is Turning Point and also Brand Launcher and I kept when I'm marking companies was called Lumpy Male, flat male, flat response at lumping get a bump in response so that company actually sold not long ago and I focus on Turning Point. Because I believe that it's important for everybody who runs a business to have a one page life plan and focus on what matters most and I have an ardent belief that when you're clear about what matters most and you can focus on that and be in your zone in what we call your thrive zone then the results are amazing internally and externally so that's the framework to hopefully answer the question they asked me and you asked me for one example, I'll give an example Daniel you like: so Daniel Eli is a really interesting guy I'll give you a quick before and after. The couple things I want to talk about to share with our listeners is. Two concepts number one in some we call Upper jumping monkeys in number two is thriving


Umar: So did you see upward jump monkeys?


Jon: Yes, upward jumping monkeys it's going to be the heart and heart and soul of the conversation I would like to have with you today.


Umar: Go for it


Jon: So what is an upper jumping monkey in upper jumping monkey has two components the external upper jumping monkeys an internal up and jumping monkeys and we want to talk about the care and the feeding of the upper jumping monkeys. I'll give you a classic example of an external upper jumping monkey. Is that let's say that you own a business and you have employees who work for you many people suffer from upper jumping monkeys and why they suffer because they're real goal is to increase well call asset ability, asset ability. Asset ability is ability to actually grow your business and create an asset as opposed to a glorified job so if that's the game so the goal is not just to work on the business but to be able to work in the business and create an asset, if you could step back, or step out of, or sell and so Daniel suffered for upper jumping monkeys in a huge way. Daniel own a company called Prepaid Experts and it was a cell phone company. He was brilliant and he suffered from upper jumping monkeys that we discovered how and why when we started doing a process flow map which is one thing that we do is we can look at how are decisions made and what's your role and are you living in what we call your greatest habits H. A. B.U.T. habit stands for the highest and best use of your time.


When a person is clear about their habut their highest and best use of their time then they can manage their internal an extra external upper jumping on cues so here's what happened he was not in his habit which his greatest habit is to be able to make deals work in the company work on the company strategically and he was really good at seeing market and the sorts of things but he spent a lot of time in the weeds and if you listen to this if you own a company or any company for sure you're also going to feel that as well. So therefore what happened we looked at what happening was that all decisions big decisions also reported back to him and to his managers when we call when we call ruin the other one will call M.R. and unlike Isaac a lot of the decisions end up coming back to him and we realize wow you're actually the greatest light and the greatest shadow you're the greatest asset and the greatest bottleneck and what we're going to talk about today Umar is how to identify your greatest habits the highest and best use your time play to your strengths compensate for your weaknesses and then thrive one of the first things is being really honest about what's going on in so we have an assessment online that anyone who's listening can get which is And from so on that on that assessment helps you assess where you're thriving where you're not.


So Daniel started to notice that wow he is actually is actually an asset in a bottleneck and once we start identifying the bottleneck he identified something that might be a little bit challenging for many of us is the fact that you know many of us identify that we're really good at something and that's the light shadow thing if you're in business most likely you have a tremendous light and that means you're really good at somethings and if you're really good at one thing you're probably really lousy another and he was really good a big picture and his great strength was not managing all the people and so many times what happens is we are over responsible every business owner I've met is over responsible that's the great light they're professional they're responsible they're responsive and know what happens when you're like that you suffer from upward jumping monkeys.

Someone walks into your office and like Hey Umar I got this problem we have a client over here they haven't probably the shipment or we got a bidding issue or we have a production issue and you're like oh OK in turn you're thinking OK look I'm really good at this I'm really responsible let me try to help them out. And so you've just identified upper jumping monkey and so therefore you've got to ask yourself OK what do I do now most people make the mistake what you think most people do when they see an Upper jumping monkey?


Umar: They grab it.


Jon: they grab her so if they're lucky enough they're aware next is they think oh what I need is a monkey repellent and they take their spray can like no get away from me you go deal with yourself or they're like I mean burn so many times and I've had the pleasure and the privilege of working and mentoring thousands of entrepreneurs and owners literally in sales people and when I found is that so many of them are so prepared and willing to actually do it themselves so they get stuck in it.  and it's upper jumping monkey jumps off their their employees back and jumps right in their back like oh yeah I can help you because their inner game is off they forgot the first principle that we said the purpose of business is to build an asset increase asset ability and thrive in so what you're actually doing is you're hurting them and you're hurting you. Tell me if that makes sense?


Umar:  It makes perfect sense and so some people have this belief that you know if you want it done right do it yourself so how do you get owners to change that if that's like ingrain at the end of a….


Jon:  Really great question so let's go back to upper jumping monkeys. So we had this guy comes up and says I got a problem with the client and Daniel or me is the owners think OK I can help you with that so one I've either been burned before I could do it better than anyone else and they were too so I'm thinking monkey repellent but I'm going to tell you what I actually think the secret is the secret is what you need instead is a mirror. What do I mean a mirror so goes the company I'm sorry so goes the leader so goes the company wherever the leaders strong company strong leaders week the company will be when you have a guy who's a fantastic engineer the company's going to great engineering and lousy in and Mosul intuitiveness and reading clients when you have a guy who's in task salesman right and he's really strong there but he's really not so organized So the company's going to be really strong in sales in reading people and lousy in process of fulfillment. So the first thing is to take a mirror in say what am I doing here and what we realize is a couple of big mistakes in maybe I can share with you a few of the big mistakes and how to overcome them to answer your question what do we do instead of doing it myself yeah.


Umar:  Of course that's a big struggle for a lot of others.


Jon:  so the first piece is, and by the way the only reason I can say this Umar, maybe I am embarrassed to say but I have screwed up so many times I mean so many mistakes in I am wounded healer that means that if you're an alcoholic you don't help other alcoholics if you are a someone who like candy from him she is her son got killed by a drunk driver can't. Manage. So she's a woman here so I too am a wounded healer it here or I to him passion about freedom teams or freedom systems because I have in still suffer when I'm not conscious of some of the following problems I share with you so it's not.


Umar: So that’s a label people have given me too wounded healer.


Jon:  So this is not about I'm up here and you're down there oh dear listener it's about you know around this to. Share with you the. Share with you some the struggles and some the challenge and how to overcome them so the first piece is in turn let's talk about the internal upper jumping monkeys before we do with the external upper jumping monkeys. Internal upper jumping monkeys come from are the lower part of our psyche and it's where you know you're for me with a hand model of what's in a reptilian brain the reptilian brain is that part of our cortex that the part of our brain that's kind of by the spinal cord where it's you are a reptile you have a stimulus response someone says you cut you off you like (15:40-15:43 not clear) punch you so. Response when you grow you actually can put some space in it in between the serious response. Next time someone cuts you off, like oh OK what's going on for the person as opposed to doing something that's you're responding so the first thing that happens with upper jumping monkeys is realizing that there's a stimulus response someone's coming in my gut reaction is like. My ego is my amigo, I'm smart, I'm responsible.


Umar:  So just put some science behind it I think they've measured it at the medulla gets triggered in five milliseconds and if you go to the hippocampus we have some reasoning and thought. That's a five hundred millisecond route so the initial responses lightning fast and the question is how you catch it so.


Jon:  What we what we need to do is, first of all, have a mirror so to speak and raise your awareness and see when you start doing things that are not in your greatest habit and we're going to talk a little later about how to identify your greatest habit and if you recognize an up or jumping monkey This is the first thing is inner upper jumping monkeys in the were external upper jumping monkey. So internally so this is ego driven isn't it interesting it's the reptilian response of like oh I can do this and so that's the next thing the second thing is giving too much value. So giving too much value means that because my ego is my amigo and I know so much I'm going to try to provide value in some time so many of us at least the people I work with they are smart, talented, insightful, successful and wherever they go they want to add value you know it sometimes dude don't add value help me instead so that's the next piece and I want to give you a couple more. Have questions before I continue on?


Umar:  OK no please go on.


Jon: Now we're starting to realize that oh yeah what this is really about is empowering other people and so therefore I've got to get my brain out in the sense that I can do it all I need to do it all and instead I want to actually build what we're going to call a freedom team in a freedom system and so I'm going to give you a little bit of the science of. Where upper jumping monkeys come from on the external side. Number one is you actually created something called learned helplessness so I'm sure you know the science between learned helplessness that Martin Seligman did a very famous experiment with dogs that today would probably be against the law to do because what he did in the one nine hundred seventy S. Was when he would put a dog in on one side of a cage and then have a small tiny little hurdle so they can jump over and go into other side the cage on one side of their cage they would have shocked I would go on the floor and if the dog was able to they would just jump over and they get out of it and so it turns out that nearly ninety percent of the dogs would jump out when they were shocked and go to the side where they're safe then but the other there's another group unfortunately they were given shocks and they couldn't go anywhere so then what happened was right these animals started this is where we get the concept of learned helplessness. Learned helplessness means that now when the shock comes those animals that learned before that they couldn't jump anywhere they didn't do anything and so those animals that knew that they could jump out they would jump out in so what's happening here from any upper jumping monkey. Process is that you've trained your employees of learned helplessness they walk in your office and say look Umar I've got an issue I need your help. And you're like oh great I can help you and so therefore they're like OK good I've now learned helplessness that I can do this that's the first thing to recognize.


Umar:  So just adding to that like sometimes. That happens but do you think sometimes they go OK this is what's expected of me is that the boss wants this even though the boss didn’t actually say that that they've set the norm and sometimes this helplessness and sometimes I can make a decision without him because he wants to be involved in everything even though that wasn’t his intent.


Jon:  I think you are totally right what you're saying and so therefore the upper jumping monkey internally there is that he's actually shooting a because he's like oh I'm like the genius with a thousand helpers and it's all about me but it's not it's not all about you I've never met an entrepreneur who's a leader of a company that gets it all done himself.  If you want to do that be a soprenuer and do it yourself that's not my business I work with people that want to build an assets in the only way to do that is to build a Freedom Team or freedom system you know or do that you actually really honestly actually have to believe in people in so I'm going to come back to Daniel Eli in a minute I just want to be a little bit more science has I know your science guy about how this actually has come about and then how we're going to deal with this or the first thing that we said why it happens is because you've actually created learned helplessness in your employees and so therefore you have an incentive empowering them and I'm a share with you a technique something we have a we create call a coaching card which instead you become a coach instead of a cop and you become a leader instead of a juror so we'll come back to coaching card if you can remember to ask me and when to stay within your we lie and I'm a show with you one more piece of science if you're OK for about why we actually do it so this next week in Science yes is coming comes from a Greek myth and it's called the Pygmalion effect.


So Pygmalion Effect where the very best my friends and I personally a Greek myth which is a guy love this he loves the statue that he made so much that she came comes to life so in other words what we believe in starts to come to life so that means that if we think that our workers are jerks they're jerks. If we think they're amazing they are amazing and you repeat that because most people don't really believe I just said you know the words if you see the world as a negative fight you'll experience the world is going to fight if you experience the world with scarcity you will experience scarcity if you experience in understand your workers to be not good enough you will have workers who are not good enough it starts internally.

Umar:  And I think. The Talmud put it nicely we do not see the universe as it is we see it as we are right.


Jon:  So based on this base and we are saying the Talmud and. There is an insight that was research that was done by Jove even in US So what he did was you know had this connection to his you're so they assessed Israeli army so generals and commanders and they said before these were called employees before the soldiers come in there's three groups those that we predict to be really successful call them the high performing high potential, those that are normal, and those that we don't know if they're good or the not good so and however. And we're going to say you're ready is we're going to we'll tell you who they are and it's based on a very famous science experiments as well that happened in a school where they told the teachers about the children they said which students are going to be really smart wish it was a really stupid this was done Israeli army and so what I want you do is I want you to learn the names by heart in their scores are so you know who are the champions and who are the losers and so sure enough what happened was those that predicted high those are predicted to perform much higher their body else guess what after the course their performance way are performing everybody else those that were normal Those are the lowest scores and those that they didn't actually know those were actually in the middle meaning that if I thought you're going to champion your champion that you're a loser you're a loser but the truth is none of that was true it's all made up and so in fact what we learn is that people rise to what we believe in them. So tell me if that makes sense?


Umar:  Makes perfect sense I mean expectations are a powerful thing.


Jon:  So we're applying are typically now to growing a business up or jumping monkeys increasing your sales in thriving more so you can build an asset and we're going to call a freedom team a freedom system and what we said so far was that in order to do this we have internal upper jumping monkeys in external upper jumping monkeys and we spoke a little about how being the fact that we're responsible that becomes in our way our ego gets in our way and we try to give too much value gets in our way and so the other side is that we've actually taught others that they can't do this you need to depend on me we spoke about these how these dogs learned that oh you're helpless and you can't I very touchy that if you have a problem you come to me and then we also spoke about you're going to perform exactly the way that I see you and nothing more and I'll give one more piece of science and they were going to go jump into it. Should I give one more piece of Science or jump into?


Umar:  OK so the jump in turn and if you're interested later it's about the elephants essentially elephants are very powerful but they don't realize how powerful they are.


Jon:  OK So here's what happened with Daniel and here's what can happen with you here some ways now to start changing the game of managing well call the care in the feeding of upper jumping monkeys internally and externally so the first thing is to understand your goal if you want to have more control and if you want to have more influence the person who gives up control actually has more power and influence in the one that maintains control and I say that again Dave Marquette said in a beautiful way he wrote a book called turn that ship around and he took the Santa Fe which was the worst performing vessel in the United States Navy and it came the best and one of things that he says in a very eloquent way is that the only way to increase your influence is by giving up control, but here's the catch you are you're a fool if you give up control without increasing competency. In other words, if you give up control that's called dump and run and I know that because I am a victim of dump and run. No not a victim I'm a pervert I'm a perpetrator dump and run I've had so many assistances in so many businesses over the past where I like you know I don't like doing it, dump and run you know what happen I'm so frustrated they're such it is that in do what I was expecting because I didn't go through the following process of showing them exactly needs to happen I saw myself as a cop instead of a coach I didn't believe in them and I didn't increase competency first you know.


I didn't focus on my greatest habits the highest best use of my time in then go through the important and step by step process of identifying those things which are not my greatest happed the high space use my time in then train other people how to do them. So with Daniel what we did was we said OK here's you have anything that's not let's move it on so the first thing I did was we said OK we need a we need agreement and actually made him sign a contract I refused the contract I didn't hear you know I do hereby pledge that I will allocate one day each week to the company's mission for continuous improvement and today's actually performing the duties of the market research and development director I further you know this I continue performing orders to best my abilities and he signed it and then we also started some job contracting agreements of other people responsible for.


Now, so amazing things start to happen for him in particular when he got to focus on the high specialist this time. Number two they no longer felt a sense of learned helplessness. Number three he moved into more of a coach as opposed to a cop and number four he stopped being the bottleneck and started being an asset in the start to play to his lighting compensate for a shadow which is the whole goal most of us get stuck in cop and coach in so what were the results of such a thing his sales increased nearly ten times that here so sales an up of over one hundred million dollars. The reduction of the dependence on Him reduced nearly ninety percent and he was able to take off four months four months from his business and the company basically ran by self and we increased the asset ability to sell the company I believe an increasing asset ability whether you sell or whether you keep an asset you shall reap.


So we increase the asset ability of the company merely twenty times in a number happy to say that in of actually selling the company for just say a lot of money so that he doesn't have to work anymore and now he's able to spend this time he has charity work and he manages investments and he does tons of volunteer work and he now has the freedom to do what matters most to him in his life where that come from that came from managing an identifying the internal upper jumping monkeys the external jumper jumping monkeys helping identify. What his greatest habit is the highest, best use of his time, giving up some control in increasing the competency of those that were around him and I'll take a pause for a moment and give you a chance to ask any questions because I need to share with you one of the most important things was I told you that he signed an agreement and the next thing I really want to talk about is accountability in the Sword of accountability.


Umar:  So the question I have for you John is this, is that your best guess if we had ten C.E.O.'s that listen to this podcast and go oh my God this is exactly what I need they come to you or someone else develop those mechanisms in place what percentage of those C.E.O.'s even though they desperately want it would not want to give up that old lifestyle of being center of attention needed if wanted? Does that question make sense, but sometimes you want something but we have these hidden highs In the old way that keeps.

Jon:  This makes sense and some people do it but can most people do it and can I do it if I'm listening to this I don't know like can I do it that's the real question I want to ask and so in my experience is that some will some won't so what, next great relive your life some is going to some people are going to rise to it some won't so what, next I'm like that guy walking on the beach the guy walking on the beach you know what he's doing is throwing starfish into the ocean in this kid walks up and said Mr Why are you doing that look at these thousands of starfish you can't possibly say them all in prices back to Manila that's true I don't need to but I can save this one and that one in these people once I can make a difference in their life and so some people listening today they're going to be prepared and willing to do it and some not and that's OK And you know it's.


Umar:  Look at the question the other way around that some of the people want the Nirvana but something within them stops them it's a kind of what you read on that before we move on like you mean like your thirty second one minute. Because a lot of times business people human beings struggle with you know I want X. But they cling on and they hold on as if their life depends on it to the old way so.


Jon:  I'm not sure if I'm totally qualified to answer and I still I'll share with you my personal approach to it. I'm just program called the ten gates of unstuck in you know that you once said hey I want to buy that domain for you know if we do that it's a very deep program and the first step of getting unstuck is identifying what's working, what way of being is not working for you and what's not and the thing that's also really important to know is that as we we all have to get clear on where the pain and where the problem is and also what the promise of a better future is and I think the mistake a lot of people might make and I don't know because there were all different but a lot of mistakes that a lot of us make is that what got me here won't get me there in other words the the mistake that we make is those voices that have been really helpful in the past that have protected me I don't need to I don't I really should not be disrespecting them and I need to learn to not have a conversation with those lower voices those a few of the reptilian voices that know no difference between the a stimulus response that like it's a you know it's about pretty protection I need food shelter.


I need just like the Maslow’s hierarchy would say first I have to make sure I got enough money, I need to make sure that I'm respected and you know make sure I'm loved. So those voices are very good voices, and if you tell a person you have to get rid of them they're going to resist it but. If you share with the person hey you know I got those voices too and now I don't know and I have those voices you have them and we don't need to throw them out but we do need to do is manage them in that voice that has trying to help you make sure that you put enough food on the table that's not a bad voice it's a voice that's part of us and we need to learn to negotiate with it and say hey you know what I'm going to work hard today and we you and I also agree that the most important thing that matters in our life is my wife or my children in so let's agree on a time to stop and when we come back that time we're going to you know want to say well let's keep going in you know what I hear you and if it really hurts us to make a list at the in the day and I'll come back and we'll do it the tomorrow.


What I'm sharing with you is a very deep way of acknowledging those things have been very helpful and helped us get there that need to be respected, and acknowledged, and managed as opposed to shill.


Umar:  Right, great so thank you for that. That really helps.


Jon:  you're not only are you still in another fellow I'm ischemic up his name we'll call Michael. I once wrote a check to the American Nazi Party why would a guy named John Goldman write a check to the Nazi party? Don't hang up now if you listen for a chance because you got to hear the end of the story I wrote a check to the Nazi party to counterbalance the other check that I also wrote to United Cerebral Palsy However neither was checks I was going to mail I had a client who I was working with and this is the this piece is so important he was really responsible and he was responsible like Daniel he had a very large company that was growing growing he would get up at four o'clock in the morning going to set up always guys to go for the day and he would set up the he would set up the team to go out and I can't say who is name is but I would say that he won a contract that has to do with the Super Bowl and really smart talented guy and he also had a killer several polls and really he didn't spend time with his kids as much as he wanted to and he was work work work but the truth is he left his wife his wife left him and he want to spend time but he wasn't quite sure how to do it.


So I said sort of accountability was the next thing that would be necessary for Daniel and for all of us if you want to make the shift of instead of being a doer to being an owner if you want to build a freedom team in a freedom system issue an increase asset ability and if you want to be able to manage upper jumping monkeys so then you have to actually start to create accountability and accountability as a sword that goes up and goes down the sort of counting everyone knows goes down is like I'm going to hold you those external jumping monkeys accountable and so here's what you're Here's what your K P I's are your key performance indicators here's how I'm going to valuate you but also goes up, also goes up. Meaning I need to be held accountable so the problem that so many owners have from our is that they're not prepared or willing to be held accountable and so what we did with this fellow was I sent him a. We got to put some teeth in this you know what's one thing that you and I would both hate to do?


I would hate to send a check to the Nazi party so you are both going to write a check to the Nazi party I'm going to hold onto it and what's one thing that we really love is to give a check to United Cerebral Palsy. And so here's the deal is that you have agreed now that you need to be done by six six we defined a specific six means that you stop working by six not that you know my six in that between six and six fifteen you leave and sometimes it happens if you can't you simply can't obviously that becomes the norm instead of the exception so we're in trouble and so we agreed to it. We enrolled his wife, we enrolled his employees we got my team and rolled in so we were checking with this guy for months on a regular basis to make sure that he would check in so now at the end of these three to three months I don't know exactly what was. Do you think that he made the shift that was deeply embedded to him about being responsible getting up early I mean instead of staying working till late at night and getting up early do you think you made the shift or you think you were back to his old way?


There is no way they were all I'll just send a check to the Nazi party so I could not let him fail nor could he feel I have done this so many times in so many people and. And I've seen remarkable things happen so the sort of accountability means that he needs to be held accountable and also we need to hold others accountable and so that's one of the most important things in terms of accountability is identify and find someone who is compassionate, who is ruthless and consistent, that can help hold you accountable in my business we that's what we do is I have a whole team of coaches and mentors and in consultants that work with our clients we hold them accountable to that which they feel there is most important to them no one's laying a trip on them and when you find some like that you have an accountability relationship that's fantastic. So he was then held accountable in all ends we also hold his team accountable and I've seen this happen I can also share with you one that there's a fantastic turnaround Jeff Jeffrey. In this piece accountability, so Jeff Jeffrey is a really beautiful interesting guy he owns a company Chicago called Erm Co. So Erm Co, it’s a bizarre company they sell lubricants it's metal lubricants I can say you may make cars and in order to in order to make them in order to make the cars so you have to. You have to have lubrication in the machines in oil basically we can so really messy he has something because water based lubricants not so relevant to our conversation but what is relevant is that one of the things that he struggled with was internal upper joint monkeys and external upper jumping monkeys and so what happened to make a long story short about him was that he was only the nicest guys in the world and he really didn't want to.


He really didn't want to be held accountable holding people accountable so much because of the next concept courageous conversations so the only way you're going to be able to do this rice to be able to have a courageous conversation and create a safe space in so he really didn't like. He'd like to be like like the rest of us I living like and he didn't like facing discomfort confrontation so he had to have a conversation with his mother who are who because he inherited the business but he's a Georgian with his brother who's in the business who ultimately let go of with his executive team both up and also down with other team members also prospects and current customers. When he starts to master this an amazing thing happened, so what happened was he was now willing to use this sort of accountability up and down in Will. And to create a safe space and a question conversation about himself which required being real and honest transparent willing to face the hard stuff and what happened when his company had been in business for over one hundred years.


Do you want to hear the results or do you have any questions about the results?


Umar… Tell us the result Mr….


Jon:  The company's current Co And yes not long ago he called and said, you know I'm he was crying was he crying he said I'm sitting in a gas station outside of prospect and it's unbelievable I just received a phone call for someone who wants us to do this partnership I want to go into what it was and I'm getting calls from all over the world and I just put my dream house in my team the team is the companies knowing it depended on me I'm more free in there and have a more wellbeing than I ever had and our sales have increased one hundred percent after being in business for over one hundred two years in the last four years which is amazing they had a in the last two years there are four hundred percent increase in the bonuses that they paid out to their people because we started to believe in them when we spoke about believing in people and the Pygmalion effect he start to believe in them.


They still have courageous conversations and they start to rise to the occasion and he let his ego go instead of the egos amigo instead of being a cop you from cop to coach and in doing so he also was able to then obtain the two largest accounts have been calling or for over fifty years because it creates conversations that look some will some won't so what next either if you think we're good so great let's move on if not so let's do as well but, I need to be really integrity with you and have a crazy conversation whoa they really respected and he so in the zone and now he's number one in the entire industry what they do to me because they were able to focus on this one component of courageous conversations and anyone that wants we can give a link on how do you have courageous conversations especially if you don't if you like to avoid conflict or you're worried about being like are the sort of thing. So that is what created this entire turnaround from on a percent sales, after one-hundred-year old company.


Umar:  So John if you've got a ton of knowledge to share how can people get ahold of you and access some of these tools and get on your calendar?


Jon:  Number one, is you can go to and you can also contact us at com and you can also call or office and set a time just to talk and they'll see if who'll be the right person to help you whether it's me or someone else in that phone numbers 401-235-7070 and although I don't think that we have enough time I could also share with you what I would call a coaching card which is how to shift from being a cop to a coach and allow you the last way that you can actually learn how to manage upper jumping monkeys so that you yourself can produce more sales you can thrive more you can build up the people around you and you can actually have a company that's more of an assets as opposed to a glorified job.


Umar:  John thanks so much the same down with me I learned a lot.


Jon:  Yes it's my pleasure so I look forward to speaking to anyone that wants that coaching card can contact us there and just let us know by coaching card and also we'll put the link on with the information put up thank you so much more I love the fact that you're giving so much value to your listeners and thank you for the opportunity and I hope that people are smart enough to listen to every word you say because you have so much insight I personally love listening to your stuff and I listen to it again with the pen and paper


Umar:  Thank you so much. If you enjoyed this episode please go to I Tunes and leave a five-star rating if you're looking for more to just go to my website at, I've got a freak mind training course that's going to teach you some insights from the world of neural tube was to programming and that is the fastest way. To get better results.